Vertical integration. The term itself is daunting, but the results are lucrative. In this episode, Pierrette Tierney, VP of Business Development at Magleby Construction, lifts the veil and gives the lowdown on how you can make vertical integration work for your company.
Business Growth & Workplace Culture with Vertical Integration
Pierrette also has excellent insights on how going international has helped Magleby, even if it has given a little more work to the HR department, as well as some insights on how to take a sniper approach to better market to a higher end clientele.
But Pierrette maintains a positive workplace culture despite the large scope of her company, and she uses every member of her team as an extension of the business development department, always looking for ways to represent the company in a positive way.
Learn all about it here on Builder Funnel Radio.
- 0:40 Episode overview
- 1:35 Pierrette's unexpected path toward business development
- 4:11 How Pierrette does business development
- 5:29 The benefits of vertical integration
- 8:10 The various brands of Magleby
- 11:57 Pros & Cons of vertical integration
- 14:39 Biggest challenges of vertical integration
- 16:56 How to snipe the high end market
- 24:07 Why Magleby doesn't need their website to generate leads
- 26:48 Focusing on recruitment with social media
- 29: 36 Connecting with Pierrette and Magleby
- 30:31 The Fast Five
- 33:55 Spencer's takeaways
Full Episode Transcription
Note: this podcast was transcribed automatically and may contain minor grammatical errors and missed words.
Welcome to builder funnel radio here you'll learn about how to grow your home building remodeling or contracting business. If you're not growing, you're moving backward. So we want you to always be in growth mode. This podcast has really turned into a movement and community of people who want to grow personally and professionally. Here we bring you some of the best marketing sales and business minds in the industry so you can elevate your business.
All right, let's dive into the show.
Hey, welcome back to builder funnel radio. This is Episode 75 with pure tyranny of maccoby construction. This episode is awesome. we dive into lots of different topics but we talked about their company history and why they've decided to vertically integrate lots of pieces of the business and add the benefits that have come along with that, I think you'll find it pretty interesting and helpful to you. And then we also talk about kind of taking a more sniper approach to marketing if you are kind of targeting that super high end clientele. So we would cover that as well. And kind of the specifics around what activities, you know, her and her team are doing on a weekly or monthly basis to enable that. So I think you guys will really enjoy this again, it's a really interesting company history and background, and lots of actionable pieces of information for you. So let's dive right in.
Hey, Pierrette, glad to have you on the show today.
Hi, thank you.
Yeah, I'm excited for the conversation because you and I connected Originally, I saw you guys were doing some cool things on the marketing side. But as you and I connected and started talking, I realized, gosh, you have an incredible company history and some really interesting and cool things going on. So I thought it would be awesome to also kind of dig into that and
Our conversation today. But before we get too deep in the weeds, maybe you can just give us a little bit of your background and then how you got involved in the construction world and then the family business, I guess.
Yeah, absolutely. So I do have a pretty long history in construction and real estate, which is interesting, because it's definitely not a path that I thought I would take. And I went to undergrad at UC San Diego and studied communications and actually vocal performance as a singer. Oh, wow.
And then I went to graduate school at USC and studied journalism. And I ended up having a friend who worked at Pulte Homes in Las Vegas that was part of the big college recruiting movement in the early 2000s. And I actually helped her set up recruiting trips to USC, more as a friend versus an interested party in the day, and anyway, but she was a great salesperson. still one of the best Katie waiter worked with her for a long time. I'm at polti. And she ended up selling me on kind of coming into the homebuilding world. And polti relocated me to Las Vegas and paid for my real estate license. And one of the things that I found that I loved about it was that it was different every day, different from journalism, but kind of a similar like, you don't really know what you're going to get into every single day. And so I liked that spontaneity and that continual learning element of it, and ended up kind of moving through the management ranks pretty quickly went from polti to Taylor Morrison and I was there for close to 10 years, loved the organization and ultimately was division president in the Bay Area for them. And my husband's family business has been in this kind of similar path here in the state of Utah, but much more custom. So my experience kind of grew from production to more urban in the Bay Area. Some some My custom there. And now I work at maccoby construction in a fully custom construction environment. So it's been fun to explore all these different areas of our industry.
Yeah, yeah, you've seen a lot. And so now that you're with maccoby construction, what are you doing? You know, there, what's kind of your role and your specialty?
Yeah. So I came on as VP of business development. And it's an interesting structure where we are truly much more of a construction company. What I've realized about a lot of the large publicly traded you know, kind of regional all of those production builders is that they're really more of a project manager kind of function. And they, you know, set out and hire a lot of the trade groups to actually build the homes. Here at maccoby. We've got a vertically integrated workforce. So we actually have our excavation teams and carpentry teams, and we have our own Mills. We build our own doors and cabinetry. So just the depth of what we do and been an interesting shift for me. And so my role in business development isn't only just getting new custom clients for our state home and remodel group, but it's also helping to recruit for our employee base for our trades, getting involved in kind of getting them out into the network of general contractors that are interested in working with us. So it's been a really fun breath of I guess, business development.
Yeah, yeah, you've got quite the variety going on. And let's dive into the vertical vertical integration piece. Because you're right, you don't see that very often. And I think that's very unique. And I guess I'm curious, where did you start within, you know, that where it was kind of the company roots, but then why was that decision made? Because you do see a lot of people kind of go, yeah, I'll just sub this out. And then you end up kind of being that project manager.
Yeah. So my father in law who started magby construction about 45 years ago. He started as a framer himself. And so he always kind of had a passion for the trades and, and understood how much of you know, their work really reflects right on the GC. And the more you can control the parts and pieces of both schedule and quality, the faster you can sort of improve and drive your business. And so as he elevated into really, really high end luxury Custom Homes, I mean, the houses that we build out here are pretty remarkable if anyone's ever been to maggle deconstructions website, but it's, you know, extremely discerning clients who want every detail to be perfect. And so kind of the way he got into some of the trades was that he would get frustrated with what he was receiving from the market and was like, forget it. I'm just going to do it myself, right. One thing at a time, and we really have focused and we have excavation part of that is just He also loves equipment. He likes to play on equipment. So we buy a lot of our own in house equipment. But a lot of the other trade groups I found we focused in, like carpentry finished carpentry. In Utah, there's a lot of wood work in our homes, the cabinetry and the mill operations. So to be able to build your own cabinets and doors and moldings, that's like the kitchen is the heart of your home, right. And that's the heart and the peace and the doors. That's what the homeowner is going to interact with every day and touch and feel. And there's a big difference when the quality is there and customization is there and so a lot of it was literally control, right? They wanted to improve quality and schedule. And then now as everyone in the industry whether your production or customer understands labor is just a nearly impossible thing to recruit for. We now you know, it's been a really good model for us because now we've got guys has been with our company for 3040 years. were loyal who are recruiting their family and their friends. And, and we're just trying to control our destiny as much as possible.
Yeah, yeah, I like that a lot. And I would imagine, as my mind is racing, I want to jump into several areas here. But we'll start with, I guess from the the sales and marketing front, I would imagine, you know, it gets a little more complex, because you have different customers. And just as you're describing that you have your own Mills, I'm sure. It's not just to fuel your own projects, but you probably sell, you know, to just, you know, other companies that need that as well. And so, I guess, does it fall into different buckets? Is that a challenge, you know, because that's different from saying, Hey, I'm going to sell a home and that's all I marketing versus kind of almost got these different business units, I would imagine
hundred percent. Our org chart is very confusing. And we actually about or five years ago, we rebranded some of our Trade base to be masterpiece trade services because we were finding that a lot of other general contractors have found our team and it's a great way for us to, you know, ensure that they're leveraged over our projects are typically the priority of quarter. And if there's gaps in a queue, especially when you're doing custom stuff, you know, there's just things that that have gaps and so they're able to then supplement by working for outside trade or outside general contractors. So I spend a lot of time again kind of getting their name out. In addition, the manual the construction, and the reason for the rebrand was our name is pretty well known in Utah and the other general contractors don't love when a maccoby truck pulls up. So the masterpieces worked really well. And then right around the time that I moved out to Utah, we actually also branched into commercial millwork. So we're technically an international company. Now. We have over On Congrats, Hell, yeah, we have a million Mexico. That's pretty saying commercial cabinetry. So I spend time getting to go down there and promote that business as well. So, and then we've branched into Sun Valley, Idaho, and we're moving into big sky, Montana. So it's this combination of promoting marketing brands as well as kind of helping us strategically enter new markets.
Yeah, that's interesting. So how many brands do you have under the you know, the one roof I guess, so to speak.
So we have maccoby construction, which has sub brands like estate homes, remodel property services, there are certain you know, other sub categories. Then we have masterpiece, and that incorporates more of our trade base and our cabinet Mills. And then we actually also another reason to kind of control our own destiny we're finding when you're in a custom environment, you're typically partnering with outside creative Architects from all entry, which is fantastic, and you get really unique designs. And that's why we build everything from, you know, French country to extremely contemporary because we're not pigeon holed working with one architectural style.
The downside to that for our field teams is that you've never get construction documentation that's consistent. And so again, a few years ago, we actually started our own architectural drafting studio. And that's also in Mexico, okay. They are phenomenal. They do been modeling and use a lot of technology to do 3d renderings and some of the things you're seeing more in commercial space, and then bringing that into the residential world. So our creative architects handle the design, and then a lot of them are handing off that back end documentation to our studio and next team, our third brand, and to kind of help us navigate that bridge between architecture and what's being built in the field.
Yeah, so cool. So cool. So let's jump back to the vertical integration piece just for a second, I guess for companies that are maybe listening to this and going Hmm, I hadn't thought about that before. Or maybe they had, I guess, are there any criteria or just general advice that you would give to somebody that's maybe considering that and just go I'm sure there's pros and cons. Obviously, you guys have felt like there's way more pros kind of that control your own destiny and have more control over all the moving parts. But, you know, is there a good way to think about that, you know, somebody listen to this gun. Do I want to go down that path or not? Because I'm sure it brings, you know, other things to you don't always think
for sure. Yeah. It's a you know, it is really a different world. Some of it, I mean, our mill operates more like a manufacturing facility. So it's kind of understanding how to make things as efficient as possible in a controlled environment. I definitely think you know, we've brought in outside consultants who have been in college industry and, and other manufacturing style industries to help us just think in that mentality versus thinking like a builder. And the biggest challenge, I think, with bringing trades in house is, of course, the dedication to now having a much larger diverse employee base. I really think that through as a management team, as well as, I guess, just kind of trying to keep everyone together, you've got sort of this office based mentality, and then you've got a field based mentality, and we really try to do a good job of ensuring that those teams understand that they are a unified front. And but it takes some effort for sure. You're just managing a lot more HR, right?
Yeah, totally. A lot more people. Yeah. A lot more interactions between people and different styles. I could imagine.
Yeah, you gotta be willing to really dedicate the time to the training of it as well. So We train on sort of the professionalism and attitude and accountability and all of that all the way through our system, right? Whether you're the IT guy, or you're the labor in the field, we all get consistent training on kind of that personality side. But then you also have to be really dedicated to training on building sciences, and making sure that the guys in the field can meet the quality level and that you can, you know, ensure that new people coming into the organization has system and a training mechanism in place, because otherwise you're you're just as well off to hire out to somebody else. Right.
Right. Yeah, that makes sense. And I would imagine, as, as you're talking, I was thinking, you know, you mentioned one of the big benefits is that you started to have people that would stay with you for a long time, and then they're even recruiting people into your company. And so the labor challenge maybe hasn't hit you as hard as some other people that are describing that but you've Also now got, you know more people on the payroll and you're having to kind of keep this machine turning. Do you feel like? Do you feel like one of the biggest challenges is making sure you have enough work to keep all the components going? Because obviously you can't scale up and down as quickly by just saying, Oh, yeah, well, we just won't hire that piece if we don't have the word. Or has that really been a non issue because you kind of just have more exposure by being bigger.
You know, it's interesting. I always feel personally, right, because I'm kind of in charge of bringing new business into the organization at all these different levels. Yeah. And I definitely feel a level of pressure, right. Like, Oh, my gosh, all of these guys are in gorilla. Women are dependent on us having work at every single level and having consistent work, right. I mean, that's always the challenge of homebuilding the ups and the downs and I'm not even talking market cycles. I'm just talking like this estate home is finishing and my next one isn't permitted. Yet and right now I've got a two month gap of like, what am I going to do with these hundred people? And so I think that's where we really felt like diversification of the company. You know, kind of having some of these sub brands that allowed us the most flexibility possible is the best. And obviously, right now, we're all super fortunate that the construction industry is incredibly strong. But we are blinded by the fact that we are in an industry that's cyclical. So we're constantly forecasting in advance. The nice thing about custom construction is you're typically kind of lining up your clients pretty far out, you know, so we're all we call it looking at looking at the windshield view. So we're looking to three years out in advance of like, what's our queue of work, what holes Do we need to fill? What gaps Do we need to fill? And trying to be really smart about hiring as much as possible?
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. That's awesome. And speaking of Kind of these higher end clientele I know, that's something that you guys transition to and have a big focus on, I guess how does the marketing to that audience differ from maybe, you know, just kind of going after kind of those middle of the road projects or that sort of thing, because I know a lot of our listeners are moving. Everyone's trying to push their dollar project up, I would say for the most part, not everybody, but a lot of people do like to make that move. Do you feel like that was a good move? And then yeah, how does the marketing look different?
Yeah, so it's been an interesting learning curve for me because coming from the big builders like a polti and a Taylor Morrison, Sunny I, I loved my national marketing manager and hopefully I can say this on air, but we used to, like say, the goal for marketing in a big corporation like that is like masses of asses like you need to get a lot of people through the door of every community and it's almost like this conversion ratio right? So it's like, you know, how many people can I drive to the website? How many of those Can I convert to a visit to an office? How many of those Can I convert to a contract, etc, right, some some mathematical equation. And I have had to learn the exact opposite of that in the custom world, we have a very kind of exclusive window of the type of client that makes sense for our business model. And so rather than this shotgun approach is very sniper approach, it's very specific. We don't spend a lot of money on advertising. Our website is not a traffic generating website. It's more of a third party testimonial. Very likely, our client has heard about us through some personal connection, organic connection that I've made in the market, or that someone on my team has made in the market, or a personal referral from the past client. And then they're going to our website just to validate that we can Kind of our who we say we are. And so yeah, I mean, I think that that there's a big difference in custom. And because your resources are far more limited when you're a smaller family run business, you can't spend millions of dollars on advertising. You can't even spend thousands of dollars on advertising a lot of times. So it's how do you personalize it? How do you put yourself out there with the right circle of influencers that are connected to that affluent custom buyer? We keep an eye on lot transactions. So most of our clients are coming to us, either while they're looking for a custom home site, or they have recently purchased a custom home site. And we make connections with local high end realtors, architects, interior designers, people who kind of run in that circle of, you know where our customers are coming from.
Yeah, that makes sense. And I think you know, you're right. It's more of that sniper approach when you are so focused on that that top end of The market. What does that look like tactically, you know, on a weekly basis, you know, what kinds of things are you saying? I've got to be doing these on a regular basis? Are you inviting people to lunch? are you stopping by their office? Are you going to a networking event like what does that kind of shake out to look like?
Definitely. So I'd say one of the first things that I did when I got here was realized that I technically am the VP of business development, but I needed to ensure that our entire team of 200 members understood that they are also frontline business development, right? If you're a site manager, and you're interacting with our estate, home clients sending $20 million and you impress them, you are representing maccoby so that they go out to their friends and tell their circle of friends about their experience. So I spent a lot of time kind of helping to educate the entire team on you guys we put together we put forth a brand every day in every interaction that we do, right so that I could grow I could have a full team A lot more people than I technically can do on my own. And my day to day, you know, I do spend a lot of time out, just networking being in the community, whether that's through business to business type events, whether that's one to one lunches with specific realtors or developers, I keep a really close eye on what's happening with new projects that are coming into the market. The nice thing is, again, I have a pretty limited group that I need to make sure I'm in front of, you know, there's a handful of developments in kind of Park City area or the Sun Valley area that are going to transact at a lot price that makes sense for our product price. Sure, and so that, you know, that's a good part of my day. The other thing that we have started to do at maccoby that I personally don't love social media, like I don't use it as a PR like personally all that much, but I recognize it's a total necessary evil that we've got to You know, kind of improve our presence on, especially as we're starting to see our buyers get younger and younger. Boom here in Utah, I'm sure there are other places to have this whole area called silicon slopes. And it's amazing how many like 20 and 30 year old millionaires there are out there now. And that's, you know, that's those are the platforms that they're comfortable on. So while I am not a total expert in social media, I did bring someone on the team, a millennial who is studying, you know, digital media and college right now. And he's been awesome. So we've really tried to make sure that we are posting something daily, and kind of just again, connecting third party testimonial and being relevant.
Yeah, I think that's, that's smart. Because Yeah, you're, it's like that windshield view you're talking about, you're looking down the road and you're going Gosh, all these buyers are growing up on these platforms. And if you look at some of the data, I mean, they trust what they see on the Social or third party reviews just as much as a personal like friend come in and telling them something though. They're almost equal in their mind. And so if you can get some of what's happening in the real world and just showcase it online, it becomes a powerful tool.
Calling all builders and remodelers it's that time of year we're gathering data for our state of home builder and state of remodeler marketing reports. This will be the fourth annual State of builder marketing report and the second annual State of remodeler marketing. Now in exchange for five minutes of your time, we're giving away a $200 gift cards for the winners, but everyone is getting some sweet bonuses after the completion of the survey. And we're also making it super easy to participate this year. So just text survey 233777 and we'll send you the survey link right away. Again, we're doing a $200 prize for the winner. Everyone that completes the survey get some bonuses. So just text survey 233777. And we'll send you the link. I like that approach to of saying, hey, I've got 200 people out here that are basically a part of my marketing. And that's something that I talk about a lot is like everything is marketing. It's the experience that you have while you're delivering the project, you know, because that's what's going to fuel that person to maybe say something about you guys or not, or say something bad. And so I love that approach. You're probably spending more just on time, maybe then dollars, but you're doing all that training, which is, you know, I don't think a lot of people take that step. So that's, that's super cool. And you just mentioned social media, as I was going to ask you though, like, How important do you think it is? And it sounds like it's trending maybe more important in your mind, but you said the website is kind of that third party, just take go viral. Five, who we are, do you see that shifting at all for you, as well, or mainly on the social media front?
Um, you know, I think I think people still like to visit websites, but we're finding, we're actually in the process of evaluating if we want to redo our website, it's about five or six years old now, I think. And while we update it, it's like the framework is still five or six years older. Yeah. And people just don't have the same level of patience maybe that they had in the past. I feel like ours is rather text heavy. We obviously have a really complicated story, I think, in general. And so everyone wants to like try and tell everything on a website. And people nowadays, they just want to go in and see the beautiful pictures of the homes that we've built in the past, scroll those and then call me. So you know, I'm not finding that people are spending the time to dig through all of those details. And so I think that's where a lot of builders are going to have to evaluate. I think photography and videography are super important. The nice thing is that if you can kind of build it once and then use it everywhere, that's the best method, right? So if I can have my digital marketing guy go out, he also happens to be a photographer. And a videographer is like very multifaceted, perfect. So if I can have him film, a super cool video of us like he just did one the other day up on this mountain top property where we're installing a steel stainless steel pool into this estate home. And it was like this beautiful video scene, right? And then I can post that on Instagram and Facebook, and then put it on the website. So it's like, if you can spend that resource once and use it for multiple reasons. It's fantastic. The other thing that we're finding from kind of a website and social media side is just honestly in addition to recruiting clients were almost as focused or equally focused on recruiting to talent into me. And I think every construction industry whether, you know, yeah, we all talk about qualified labor. But it's hard to even find project managers and back office staff and all of it. And so the more you can put forth a really incredible presence in all of those platforms, the more you're going to drive interest, both from a consumer perspective as well as potential employee base.
Yeah, I love that. You mentioned that we've found that to be the case, too. We've hired a couple new people here this year and been in both cycles of that hiring process. People have been looking at us on social media and going cash, I love your culture, I can see all this stuff about your team and they feel like they get to know us a little bit and it's a good way to see if they're a good match. They actually you know, think that that sounds exciting. So I like that you mentioned that and I guess switching gears a little bit, we look to the future a little bit you know, fast forward, you know, a year to out What are you kind of most excited about with where you guys are going
So it's been really fun to explore some new market opportunities. So our latest one is Big Sky, Montana. I'm not sure if you're in the custom world you've maybe heard of kind of Yellowstone club and some of the activity that's going up there. Montana, I feel like used to be like completely undiscovered, right. And now it's definitely been found. So we've always succeeded in those high end mountain markets. And it's one of those areas where I think a professional builder like maccoby construction, coming in doing it the right way, finding a local base of employees and kind of building organically from the ground up. It's just kind of it's a fun new adventure. And and then, you know, honestly, our team down in Mexico has been super exciting to see that growth and to be able to provide them with a more I guess, Americanized work environment where I really feel valued. We're training them, we're offering them this, you know, culture where work is a place that you want to go. And it's not just work, it's trying to elevate them personally, as well help them grow. We do a lot of leadership training, you know, read a lot of books that help them to understand how to be more successful in everything that they do. And they're just so grateful and so wonderful to work with. So it's been really fun to kind of have this new cultural environment involved in our company.
Yeah, that's so cool. That's awesome to hear. And I've got a few more questions for you before before I get to those. People want to learn more about you or connect with you or maccoby construction, what's the best place to connect?
Yeah, so our website is pretty simple. It's just magalie construction, calm, and all of our links to social media are posted there. So that's probably the fastest way to reach our company and I'm on LinkedIn. That's one social media platform that I you know, I don't post a lot but I do stay connected with a lot of people. I just moved so much I've been in bigger Scottsdale and Sacramento in the Bay Area and now Park City and so you know, it's a great way to stay connected in the industry and I think I'm just pure at tyranny on LinkedIn and I will be I think I'm probably the only one
yeah, I would I would guess so. And we'll make sure we link those in the show notes for everybody as well make it easy. So the last segment of our show is called the Fast Five so I'm going to hit you with five rapid fire questions you can just say what what comes to mind and and we'll go from there but first question is what is your favorite business book and why?
No, I actually don't read a lot of business books. There you go. New people out there I I actually just like to glean from others vision that are around me so close circle of friends versus readings. These books that I don't know,
fair enough. Do you want to throw in a favorite book in general?
Um, I tend to read like historical fiction books. Okay. I'll try to get out of my day to day worlds and read something. That's fun.
That's awesome. Yeah. Well, and I find to sometimes when you get out of that world, then you draw ideas from that anyway. Yeah, cool. All right. Well, who is the most inspirational person in your life?
Hmm, definitely my mother. Probably a lot of people say that. But she's just always been a really strong female role model for me. And I think surviving and residential construction and kind of a man's world. She's always taught me to be really confident. And I think that's where I've gotten to today because of her.
That's awesome. Yeah. Um, all right, favorite superpower. Or if you could have one superpower, well,
it's funny. My parents my friends have always said that I have like the strongest willpower of anyone like I can. I can make things happen. happen if I think about them enough. For example, I have brown eyes and I've always wanted to blue eyed children and I had, like, I think I have this power to manifest things if it's something that I really, really am passionate about.
That's awesome. All right. And then if you could, I guess pick up a superpower. What would that be?
That's kind of fun. Mmm hmm. That's a tough one. Maybe I don't think I want to read people's minds. It might be to
a movie or two on that and it gets a little dicey. Yeah.
You know, I probably want to like, be able to transport myself immediately. I love to travel. So I think I would want to be able to be like, Oh, I'm going to Europe today and just be there without the travel component.
Great choice. That's the best one. That's the one I picked to teleportation for sure. All right. Describe yourself in three words.
Unknown Speaker 33:01
confident, caring, and creative. Very cool. You got three
CDs in there too. Yeah, that was perfect. All right, final question. If you could leave our listeners with one piece of advice, what would that be?
I think that probably the biggest piece of advice that I have always kind of lived by is to just be open minded and everything that you get exposure to. I'm open minded in hiring process, open minded in exploring opportunities that maybe you kind of question if it's the right path. And I have just kind of I don't always say yes to everything, but I at least I am open minded to learning more.
That's awesome. Yeah, that's great advice and period. Thanks so much for joining me today. This has been awesome.
Unknown Speaker 33:52
Yeah, I'm glad we were able to connect. Thank you.
Hey, guys, I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Pierrot tyranny of maccoby construction. And again, I know you're on the go. So let's talk action items and takeaways. There were two big ones that stood out to me The first one being that vertical integration piece. So you may not want to go down that path. But I think building on her last piece of advice, which was being open to new ideas, and exploring them, I think it's worth sitting down for a little bit and just thinking through your business and saying, hey, are there other pieces that I could bring in house that maybe I'm subbing out on a regular basis now? And what would that look like? Would it bring any additional benefit? What would be kind of the challenges that would come along with that, because of course, nothing's ever just going to be perfect, but it might bring a lot more benefit to you. So you may decide to go that route. You may not but I think you'll learn a lot going through that exercise. The second one was really thinking about her comment where she mentioned that, hey, I've got 200 people that can really be a force for marketing. And so I think thinking about your team as part of your marketing efforts, and that every interaction with you know, potential customers, current customers, partners, vendors, anybody like that they can have a huge influence over somebody referring more people to you and kind of building that that marketing flywheel so to speak. So I think those two things were really great action items from today's episode. And again, really appreciate you guys listening. We'll see you next time on builder funnel radio.
Thanks again for listening everybody. And as a quick reminder, text Radio 233777 for some free goodies as a thank you for listening to the show. And if you got some value from today's episode, I just asked that you leave us a quick review on iTunes. It really helps us spread the word and grow this awesome community of people who are working to improve their lives and their businesses. Thanks again and we'll see you next time on builder funnel radio.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai